Posted
Hi,
I have been at this for days, and am now 98% certain something is not quite right in Synfire's Device Description editing/saving.
Consider this picture:
This shows the listing of patches read in from a .midnam file representing my Yamaha Motif XF. The .midnam file came from Total Librarian, and itself imported fine into Synfire.
I have since categorized all the patches in PRE1 thru PRE8 and GM. Also, the Br: patches in USER1, as the picture shows.
Every time though that I move on to finish the categorization of USER1 and then save the Device Description, the next time I open Synfire none of my work past the point shown is present.
I think I've now fully Categorized all my patches 4 times over, and never once reopened the Device Description from a fresh start and seen them all there.
Device Description file attached, to assist in troubleshooting. Thanks!
Wed, 2024-01-10 - 16:58 Permalink
Hi,
Thanks for your reply.
There are a few versions, but the one I'm working with, looking at, and uploaded above seems unambiguous to me.
Here are two pics, newly taken this morning:
The path I took to get here on startup was thru New -> Audio/MIDI Setup.
If you are seeing no asterisks (from the file above) where I am seeing asterisks (in pic immediately above), that is a huge mystery to me. Can you take a picture of that?
Thanks again.
Wed, 2024-01-10 - 17:46 Permalink
No need to take a picture. It's exactly the same w/o asterisks.
I just used the device menu Open And Add ... to add it to my device list.
The many different versions you have, also as templates, look suspicious. It should be impossible to have multiple devices with exactly the same identifier, but this mess with devices that use a different number of spaces in the name to be distinguishable is probably making a mess.
Wed, 2024-01-10 - 18:13 Permalink
What happens when you do File >> Reload All Devices And Presets ?
All the programs disappear! (from all devices)
Then, if I exit and restart Synfire I see the programs again, just like before (like the picture above).
The templates I started to save after having lost categorization work repeatedly, hoping they might save me from having to redo the work. They don't seem to help though - in fact I really don't understand what they are, what their purpose is, or how they work. Of course I tried to read the docs, but they are too terse to help me.
Templates aside, what do you recommend I do now? (I have already backed up the files outside the Synfire paths for safety.)
Wed, 2024-01-10 - 21:13 Permalink
All the programs disappear! (from all devices)
Merely an ugly refresh problem of the UI. Close Audio/MIDI Setup and open it again. No need to restart Synfire.
Wed, 2024-01-10 - 21:18 Permalink
what do you recommend I do now?
Delete all those templates and clones. Keep only the single XF device you want to edit. Every now and then go to the Properties tab and press the diskette button to save the device. Although that should not be necessary, it makes sure your pending changes are written to disk.
Wed, 2024-01-10 - 22:19 Permalink
OK, I've gone thru all the recommended motions.
Then I categorized the USER1 Bs: group, like this:
Giving me a (temporary) result like this: (Bs: patches categorized, as expected)
I pressed the Diskette icon (though it did nothing). I also did the right-click Save-As, like so:
(At this point, I also uploaded to the Repository)
All should be saved right now, yes?
Completely exited and reopened Synfire.
My work is gone, the file is as it was before I started:
I am utterly mystified.
Finally, when I fetched back from the Repository, instructing the dialog to 'Assign Unique ID', the result was correct, the Bs: patches categorized as expected.
Why can't I get a local save/restore?
Thu, 2024-01-11 - 10:49 Permalink
Thanks for taking the time to post the screenshots.
An upload to the repository merely uploads the file from your disk. A local save/restore should not make a difference.
The button is greyed out when all pending changes have already been saved. I suspect a category assignment does not flag the device as dirty here. Will check. Still, saving the device from the right-click menu will save it nevertheless.
Thu, 2024-01-11 - 12:41 Permalink
Thanks for the update.
I'll mention another thing I notice -
Often after dragging a set of patches into a category, when I then want to go right back to the full Instrument list to continue picking, a click on Categories: Instrument will not work. The highlight will bounce there and bounce back to the last category dragged to, and the patch list remains the same.
In order to successfully get back to the full Instrument list I have to click on something else first, then click on Categories: Instrument.
This dance is becoming part of my muscle memory at this point, but it is not what should be happening! (and thus indicates a need for investigation, IMO)
If you need a video of this behavior, please let me know and I'll make one.
Thanks.
Thu, 2024-01-11 - 12:47 Permalink
BTW, if you do find yourself in the guts of this and can easily make it so that after dragging some patches to a category one can return directly to where one was in the Instrument list to continue working from where one left off it would save a good deal of time and motion when categorizing a large set of patches. <g>
Thu, 2024-01-11 - 13:19 Permalink
I have now managed to get all the way to the end and upload to the repository.
Device 'Yamaha Motif XF (2)' is fully categorized (I may have left out a few singletons, hence 98% instead of 100% ?).
To accomplish this, I had to create the (2) device by uploading the original to the repository and then downloading it and creating a new ID. Attempting to continue to edit on the original device always resulted in work that disappeared later.
Since both devices are now sitting in the repository, possibly something can be learned by comparing them or working with them with debugging-level insight.
Getting to this point was a long and frustrating process. I hope that whatever the problem is it can be solved for the sake of the future.
In any case, I am very pleased to have 1760 high-quality patches categorized and ready to work with!
If anyone else here has a Motif XF, you really might want to download this. Cheers!
Thu, 2024-01-11 - 13:53 Permalink
This dance is becoming part of my muscle memory
I can feel your pain. I hate it too. The challenge is that "Instrument" has the same meaning as "no category selected" (a wild card). This turns out to be an ambiguity that's extremely fiddly to deal with in the UI code and its selection logic.
I'll check if there is a quick fix (this code is many years old already).