Posted
Hi!
I think that it would be a VERY powerful feature to be able to drag MIDI files from the desktop (or other program that supports drag exporting of MIDI) directly to an instrument or a library in Synfire (instead of having to browse and import). In fact I think having the feature is vital if Synfire is going to increase its appeal.
There are many VSTs and DAWs that support dragging MIDI to the desktop and between plugins. For example - I use Toontrack EZ Player for auditioning and editing drum/percussion sections. After editing in EZ Player, you drag your clips into your DAW or onto the desktop, or onto a plugin (such as Trilian or whatever). This speeds up the workflow MASSIVELY!
It would be great to be able to drag directly to a Synfire intrument! As Synfire relies on MIDI sources, the fewer steps needed to get these sources into your work, the better! The lack of drag and drop like this makes it a lot less appealing to use Synfire and it slows down the workflow.
Another very useful thing would be to be able to drag MIDI clips directly to a library. Or maybe a batch import function for multiple files... Many people have libraries of MIDI drum/percussion loops, and it would be so much easier to be able to drag them into a library or do a batch import, in order to be able to quickly build phrase pools.
I honestly think that having drag and drop like this would make Synfire a whole lot more powerful, flexible and user-friendly - and that would certainly increase its appeal! :)
Wed, 2013-01-16 - 16:14 Permalink
There is already the ability to batch import midi files, although that does impose some restrictions on how they are processed during the import into synfire.
Drag and drop would only make sense to a single instrument and only to the take parameter. It would still need post processing to tease out the musical meaning of the phrases, determine key progression, map to instrument ranges, etc.
Midi import in synfire does a lot more with midi data than a daw does, which is what makes it so powerful.
Wed, 2013-01-16 - 18:24 Permalink
Midi import in synfire does a lot more with midi data than a daw does, which is what makes it so powerful.
Yes, well put.
Your suggestion to drop to the Take parameter seems like a great idea.
Wed, 2013-01-16 - 18:37 Permalink
Thanks for your response, Blacksun. And thanks for letting me know about the batch import - it isn't documented in my manual.
Absolutely - drag and drop would only make sense for a single instrument and for the take parameter, but that in itself would be extremely useful. As I mentioned in the example in my post - there are libraries upon libraries of drum/percussion MIDI loops which have been professionally produced. These are in the format of single instruments and you would import as static.
As I said - there are VST plugins - such as Toontrack's EZplayer and EZKeys, which allow you to manipulate and process MIDI, and then drag and drop the results as MIDI into your DAW, or the desktop, or any plugin that accepts MIDI drag and drop in order to function, such as Spectrasonics Trilian's awesome groove lock. EZKeys accepts drag and drop MIDI which can be analysed and processed in similar but simplified ways to Synfire. Of course Synfire is much more powerful - yet doesn't have the basic, simple features of EZKeys - and it's six times the price.
What people do with the MIDI once it has been imported to Synfire is up to them, but having to jump through hoops to get it in there in the first place is a real handicap - especially when you consider how easy it is to do that with a DAW or other songwriting tools.
If Synfire is to become more popular and more accessible, then it needs to have the basics covered - not just the very clever stuff.
Wed, 2013-01-16 - 20:37 Permalink
Please don't take this the wrong way, but I think you are not fully understanding Synfire. What you say about other VSTi instrument is true with respect to how they import and process midi, but they do it unintelligently.
What do I mean? They take the note value, but they have no understanding of the harmony or why a particular note exists at a specific point of time in the parade of notes. The manipulation these programs do is no different than using 'select all' in a midi piano roll editor and then dragging all the notes up or down on the staff. In other words they only transpose. There may be a little more with the Toontrack pianos, but nowhere near what Synfire can do.
Think of a Synfire phrase as 'meta-midi.' It contains all normal midi information plus harmonic information of key signature and voice leading rules specific to the range of the particular instrument.
Actually, the opposite of what you request would be quite useful: to drag a Synfire phrase to the desktop and have it converted to a midi file to use with the instruments you mention.
+1 for drag midi file to take ... although there would have to be a dialog to ask which specific track you wanted imported to the take.
Wed, 2013-01-16 - 23:50 Permalink
No problem Prado, but actually I do understand that Synfire imports MIDI intelligently and that the other programs I mentioned do not. That is not in dispute - the issue is that Synfire cannot (intelligently or otherwise) accept MIDI source material via drag and drop. The ability to do so would speed up workflow considerably and would allow Synfire to function seamlessly with other tools, such as EZPlayer, EZKeys, which could supply Synfire with fantastic sources of MIDI data to work its magic on (or just import as static).
Please forgive me if I wasn't being clear, but I'm a little confused, as this is the second rebuttal I've had from somebody who then goes on the say that drag and drop to a take would be a good idea... Umm... Guys... That is EXACTLY what I'm asking for! Maybe I'm not using the proper terminology or something... But dragging MIDI data onto "take" with the preset on "drums and effects" would allow drops from EZPlayer, with other settings appropriate for EZKeys or any other source. Anyway - I'm just glad that everybody seems to think that it's a good idea :)
And I totally agree that the ability to drag and drop from Synfire to elsewhere as a MIDI file would be awesome. I appreciate that this is possible to an extent with dragging from drones, but it would be particularly useful if you could drag selections of notes directly from Synfire windows.
